RAM chips

[Anonymous]

Can I ask the purpose of adding distilled water as opposed to tap water to the HCl please Kurt?

 

[richard2013]

Can I ask the purpose of adding distilled water as opposed to tap water to the HCl please Kurt?

I guess its because tap water has mixed chlorine and will make a weak HCL+CL when mixed with HCL that will dissovled gold.

 

[kurtak]

Can I ask the purpose of adding distilled water as opposed to tap water to the HCl please Kurt?

I guess its because tap water has mixed chlorine and will make a weak HCL+CL when mixed with HCL that will dissovled gold.

Because I live in the country so have a well & here in the area where I live we have a real problem with iron bacteria http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_bacteria in the water - so in order to somewhat control this problem we have to dose the well everyday with chlorine tablets - so yes there is the possibility of dissolving some gold

But also because the chlorine tablets don't eliminate the problem (they only control the problem to a point) & because the problem is microbial what happens - depending on several factors like when after the chlorine tablets are added to the well or how much water is used after adding it - it cause's a problem for me in the lab

one problem is that when I put my tap water in a beaker & apply heat - even with acid in the mix - the heat cause's the iron "bacteria" to coagulate & precipitate out leaving me with the brown gelatinous slime mentioned in the wiki link - thereby contaminating what ever I am working on - this precip problem could be just a little or "a lot" again depending on when &/or how much water has been used

So I use D-water for everything I my lab & I tend to forget that tap water can be used in a situation like this

Kurt

Edit - to add from Wiki - "Treatment of heavily infected wells may be difficult, expensive, and only partially successful." --- this is my problem & a problem in general in the area I live

 

[Erceg]

You can get rid of chlorine from water simply by allowing it to sit a while. Because there is no chlorine in the air and air is infinite (for this purpose) by diffusion all chlorine should go out of water. As for bacteria problem, I heard there are some filter papers that can filter them out. Find out the bacteria size and try to find filter paper with smaller pores. I newer seen or done, so I don't know how fast it will go or if it is more practical to just use distil water.

 

[solar_plasma]

@kurtak

Very interesting, never heard of it. I wonder, if strong aeration followed by a sand filter (gravity or pool filter) and finally an active carbon filter wouldn't solve your problem? A pool sand filter has a back wash function and maybe the carbon can be reactivated to some degree by glowing.

 

[SCB]

You can get rid of chlorine from water simply by allowing it to sit a while..

Unless the water is chlorinated with Chloramine which can’t be vented/agitated off.
I don’t know about other countries but Chloramine is a quite common water treatment in Sweden

 

[solar_plasma]

Wouldn't chloramine be caught by good quality activated carbon? I would assume so.

 

[MarcoP]

Source: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloramine

Activated carbon have been used for chloramine removal long before catalytic carbon became available; Standard activated carbon requires a very long contact time, which means a large volume of carbon is needed. For thorough removal, up to four times the contact time of catalytic carbon may be required.

Most dialysis units now depend on granular activated carbon (GAC) filters, two of which should be placed in series so that chloramine breakthrough can be detected after the first one, before the second one fails.[17] Additionally, sodium metabisulfite injection may be used during circumstances.[18]

 

[kurtak]

@kurtak

Very interesting, never heard of it. I wonder, if strong aeration followed by a sand filter (gravity or pool filter) and finally an active carbon filter wouldn't solve your problem? A pool sand filter has a back wash function and maybe the carbon can be reactivated to some degree by glowing.

solar

thanks for the interest & sorry for the delay in responding - right now I am very busy trying to get things done before the winter sets in both on the home front & with my PM recovery/refining operation - we have already had one snow fall here so the real winter is just around the corner

anyway - my problem with the iron bacteria (& the problem in this general area) is really, really bad - even in the local towns where they have the best of water treatment/filtering systems they can only control the problem to a point - if you take a glass of town/city water & set it on the counter it will look perfectly clear to start with but by the end of the day it will have a "slight" cloudy brown color to it & a precipitate will be settling on the bottom

When you live in the country with a well as I do (unless you want to spend a lot of money on a water treatment system) controlling the problem is more difficult then in the towns where they have good systems in place --- my problem goes something like this

in the morning dose the well with chlorinating tablets (by dropping directly down into the well - we use calcium hypochlorite tablets) so shortly after the tablets are added & for a period of time there after - depending on how much water is used & when (washing cloths, dishes, taking showers etc.) the chlorine will be very high - high enough that you can smell it let alone taste it --- in fact I have (& do) use it for leaching CAT combs (to dilute my HCL in the leach bucket) & if I use it early enough in the day it will start leaching the PGMs almost instantly before adding any bleach

there does come a point in time when the chlorine content becomes more dilute & the water is still relatively clear (probably exceptable to use in the lab) but again that depends on water used &/or time lapsed - which is really a guessing game

later in the day (again depending on water used &/or time lapsed) as the chlorine becomes more & more dilute the water starts becoming an orange/brown in color which is when I start to have the problem of the iron bacteria coagulating & precipitating out contaminating solutions

we do have two paper cartage filters in line - but again they only help to control the problem to a point & yes I have tried using activated carbon filters as well but they don't last long & need replacing often & it gets quite spendy

I am a member of a local co-op & if I buy my D-water in bulk (10 or more cases - 6 gallons per case) they knock 10 cents off per gallon so I only pay 69 cents a gallon

I do use tap water in the lab --- just never for dissolving metals because of the well water problem

Kurt

 

[Geo]

Kurt, from your description, you can boil the water in a clean stainless steel pot and then cover and let everything settle. Use the clean, boiled water from the top without disturbing any sediment. You could also add a small amount of sodium hypochlorite bleach before the boil just to be sure. The boiling will help remove the chlorine.

 

[kurtak]

Kurt, from your description, you can boil the water in a clean stainless steel pot and then cover and let everything settle. Use the clean, boiled water from the top without disturbing any sediment. You could also add a small amount of sodium hypochlorite bleach before the boil just to be sure. The boiling will help remove the chlorine.

Yes this is actually a solution to the problem & works --- but more often then not my decision to process something low grade like the magnetic legs from incinerated chips is a spur of the moment thing like - hmmmm - today I don't have anything else going in the lab & I am going to be busy with other things all day so lets put the legs on the hot plate & let it do its thing - so its just more convenient to grab a jug of D-water pop the top - add - & move on --- just kinda got to be a convenient/habit thing - unless I wanted to take time to boil, let settle, fill jugs & clearly mark jugs ahead of time

I do "a lot" of silver so I buy D-water in bulk & relatively cheap -so back to spaceships original question of why D-water instead of tap water - its because I have a problem with my tap water so I use D-water & tend to forget that tap water can be used in some situations

Kurt

 

[kurtak]

this is to show how bad the water is - it does this to white clothing, dishes, the inside of the dish washer, the cloth washer & is hard on water heaters

Kurt

Edit to say --- & this is after chlorination & 2 inline filters

 

[macfixer01]

Have you tried flocculation? For a test you could try a little Alum. It's used in making pickles I know, so is generally found in the spice aisle of almost any grocery store.

http://youtu.be/5uuQ77vAV_U

macfixer01

 

[Martijn]

Kurt, apart from all the work of cleaning your well water for refining, just for normal use, I know silver was used in the past to keep wells fresh and free of bacteria. Since you are refining silver, maybe test a gallon with a small piece of silver to see if it kills the iron bacteria? It could be benefitial for health reasons of you and your family.
edit: added link:
http://arstechnica.com/science/2013/06/silver-bullets-that-kill-bacteria-not-werewolves/

from the text:
"Next, silver interferes with how bacteria use iron. Iron is often held in place within proteins by binding to sulfur. Since silver also interacts with sulfur, it blocks the iron from doing so."

 

[Geo]

I have also studied on how to safely store drinking water for long term storage. Apparently it is a well known fact that silver chloride is used to store drinking water for long periods. The silver chloride slowly oxidizes depleting the water of oxygen plus, silver is naturally antimicrobial and antiviral. You could use a small perforated canister full of silver chloride on a rope or small stainless chain lowered to the bottom of the well. You would need to pull it up perhaps once a year and either replace the silver chloride with fresh stock or process the old and make fresh silver chloride from that.

 

[kurtak]

Have you tried flocculation? For a test you could try a little Alum. It's used in making pickles I know, so is generally found in the spice aisle of almost any grocery store.

http://youtu.be/5uuQ77vAV_U

macfixer01

Hmmmm --- so would Alum work in acidic solutions for dropping out those nasty colloids :?:

Kurt

 

[galenrog]

I remember the grey laundry and the reddish ring around tubs and sinks when I was young. It is still a problem in most parts of western Oregon, to include municipal supplies in my little town. To combat this in the lab I use ONLY distilled water. By doing this I eliminate the additional step of determining what my water source should be for any particular process. Yes, there is a cost. The cost of making a mistake regarding water source is far higher.

 

[macfixer01]

Have you tried flocculation? For a test you could try a little Alum. It's used in making pickles I know, so is generally found in the spice aisle of almost any grocery store.

http://youtu.be/5uuQ77vAV_U

macfixer01

Hmmmm --- so would Alum work in acidic solutions for dropping out those nasty colloids :?:

Kurt

I don't know, but Alum was just the example used in the video. Besides commercial products there are some other common substances you can try like Bentonite or corn starch.
Here is some more information on flocculants. It mentions Guar Gum is used in an acid medium.

http://www.flocculants.info