In that case it is probably because he is worried about encapsulation of values by the fine carbon soot. This would seem the most likely, as it would slow down their reaction with aqua regia, and almost completely with HCl/Cl2.
***** The Platinumill Exposed and on Trial *****
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aflacglobal
Well-known member
Could you not do a prewash with dilute HCl and water to remove the carbon.
I will have my system put together by wed. I still dont know what chems. I will be using? Or if im going to heat the material up to a nice roasty red color, 700+ degrees to rid carbons. Recieved my pump today, up to 5gpm march pump, only $120, all the fittings also, will order my carbon plates (2) and filters from action mining, unless someone has another suggestion? . I plan on proccesing 20-30 lbs at a time with this system. And will upgrade as time goes by. Frog
No, I don't think HCl alone would have any effect on it.
Irons
Well-known member
Lou said:
I've put Palladium in solution with just HCl. The Palladium will strip the Hydrogen and generate free Chlorine. Platinum will do the same but it takes years.
PdCl2 is insoluble in water, so if you boil off the excess HCl, it will precipitate out as a dark red flocculent solid. It can then be filtered and redissolved with Ammonium Hydroxide, re-filtered and re-precipitated with the addition of dilute HCl.
Buzz
Well-known member
Does anyone know what the stuff you put into your petrol tank to decoke your engine is made up of?
In the UK we have a product called Redex. Maybe it's a worldwide product.
Just wondering if you could soak the cat material in it to "decoke" it?
Buzz
In the UK we have a product called Redex. Maybe it's a worldwide product.
Just wondering if you could soak the cat material in it to "decoke" it?
Buzz
I am sure it is just another word for decarbon or decarboning. Coke just being cooked coal (so to speak).
What about just taking a propane torch, perhaps with a rose tip, and put it directly to the uncrushed pieces. Should burn off the carbon in no time.
And if you want.....once they are up to temp you can douse the flame and burn the gas catalyticaly............just for kiks....
Randy
What about just taking a propane torch, perhaps with a rose tip, and put it directly to the uncrushed pieces. Should burn off the carbon in no time.
And if you want.....once they are up to temp you can douse the flame and burn the gas catalyticaly............just for kiks....
Randy
It could take alot of propane if your trying to do 150lb or sowith a rose tip torch and would be uneven?, I,m going to rig up something that just blows through the converter, like a a heavy duty shop propane heater on steroids, just Tim Allen it, put tthe converter in a vice and let her rip untill the whole converter is red, that should do it, plus it will be fun!!!
Some of the crushed material I have looks brand new, and some of it is nearly black.
This tells me that some of it will take longer to clean.
I have the bottom third of a 55 gal drum with a huge propane burner mounted underneath.
Yes, I do intend to help speed the process(especially on some of the dirtiest material) with the use of the rosebud tip.
A custom made stirrer, and a few beers should do the trick , hopefully in a short period of time. If it works... this has to be one of the cheapest ways to go about it. I intend on trying it out today!
This tells me that some of it will take longer to clean.
I have the bottom third of a 55 gal drum with a huge propane burner mounted underneath.
Yes, I do intend to help speed the process(especially on some of the dirtiest material) with the use of the rosebud tip.
A custom made stirrer, and a few beers should do the trick , hopefully in a short period of time. If it works... this has to be one of the cheapest ways to go about it. I intend on trying it out today!
Hey Mark, Your addicted to this forum also, up and at it early also, I tried to give you a shout back last night, phone tag, your it.... Lou mentions something similar to what you are doing, I wonder if the barrel will do the trick by itself, or it looks like your wanting to have a little extra fun with the torch, ha :lol: Frog
Frog,
In my long delayed Pt and Pd video I use a torch to treat the cats. I'm hoping to find a better way. I have a feeling the induction heater I'm building will help in this process. Lots of heat with out the added gas.
On my first go around with the beads, I found the carbon all came of the material after about 10 minutes in hot very dilute AR. The AR was a mixture of 300 mL of HCl, 15 mL of HNO3, and 300 mL of water.
The liquid contained a very small amount of Pd and little or no Pt. The carbon formed a fine gray sludge suspension in the liquid that settled upon setting after pouring off the liquid while the carbon was still floating in the mix.
Here's a snapshot of the sludge from the beads:
and one of the before and after of the beads:
and finally one of a honeycomb which has been heated for five minutes with straight MAPP gas, the left half of the cat has yet to be heat treated for comparison:
With the heating method you must allow time for the heat to penetrate across the entire cat structure. The carbon hides in the 'tunnels' that the cat structure forms. I feel the best approach for the removal of carbon via heat is to set up a 'bead of coals' if you will and allow the cats to sit over it in a single layer while the carbon roasts off. The heat source could be several gas fed burners or a long gas burner that the single layer of cats slowly moves over. You can monitor the progress of the removal of the carbon by observing the side of the cat, as the carbon is removed the side of the cat changes color. The cats should be laid on the burner surface with the heat flowing thru the openings in them. You will also see the gases coming out of the cats vents on the opposite side from the heat source.
When using a torch I lay the cat on it's side and slowly work the torch across the face of the cat. The edge of the cat with no holes in it is against a iron plate.
All this will be on my video when it's completed. I have so many videos to edit for this DVD it's very time consuming and I have little if no free time.
I ask everyone to please bear with me while I finish the DVD.
Steve
In my long delayed Pt and Pd video I use a torch to treat the cats. I'm hoping to find a better way. I have a feeling the induction heater I'm building will help in this process. Lots of heat with out the added gas.
On my first go around with the beads, I found the carbon all came of the material after about 10 minutes in hot very dilute AR. The AR was a mixture of 300 mL of HCl, 15 mL of HNO3, and 300 mL of water.
The liquid contained a very small amount of Pd and little or no Pt. The carbon formed a fine gray sludge suspension in the liquid that settled upon setting after pouring off the liquid while the carbon was still floating in the mix.
Here's a snapshot of the sludge from the beads:
and one of the before and after of the beads:
and finally one of a honeycomb which has been heated for five minutes with straight MAPP gas, the left half of the cat has yet to be heat treated for comparison:
With the heating method you must allow time for the heat to penetrate across the entire cat structure. The carbon hides in the 'tunnels' that the cat structure forms. I feel the best approach for the removal of carbon via heat is to set up a 'bead of coals' if you will and allow the cats to sit over it in a single layer while the carbon roasts off. The heat source could be several gas fed burners or a long gas burner that the single layer of cats slowly moves over. You can monitor the progress of the removal of the carbon by observing the side of the cat, as the carbon is removed the side of the cat changes color. The cats should be laid on the burner surface with the heat flowing thru the openings in them. You will also see the gases coming out of the cats vents on the opposite side from the heat source.
When using a torch I lay the cat on it's side and slowly work the torch across the face of the cat. The edge of the cat with no holes in it is against a iron plate.
All this will be on my video when it's completed. I have so many videos to edit for this DVD it's very time consuming and I have little if no free time.
I ask everyone to please bear with me while I finish the DVD.
Steve
fixinator
Active member
:idea: I've got a roofing torch. Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I'll try this on a cat that I am getting ready to process sometime after the snow melts enough to get to my shed. After seeing Steve's honeycomb after the mapp gas torch that this would do as well only alot faster. Fire up the afterburners!! heheheheh.
Rod
I found it! this should do the job, A I found a (sure flame) 375,000 btu torch that would do a great job (ebay search sure flame) 100 bucks, prob. like a roofing torch, I have lp here at the house and will have to see if I can switch it,,,,, Frog heres a link.... http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Propane-Torch-Sure-Flame-90-000-375-000-BTU_W0QQitemZ290075382429QQihZ019QQcategoryZ111477QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQtrksidZp1638.m118.l1247QQcmdZViewItem
loco
Well-known member
as far as firing the carbon off can anyone see an issue doing in say a cut in 1/2 burn barrel set on top of my propane burner (large propane burners thing once ignited probably has an 8 inch flame in diameter) and then speeding things up by adding torch on top side as well. I think I have 2 of types out in my fathers garage one is more custom made with it's own stand and the other mounts to a the top of a 20 gal tank.
oh yeah and those roofing torches work melting thick ice off your walk ways here in the frozen north.
oh yeah and those roofing torches work melting thick ice off your walk ways here in the frozen north.
fixinator
Active member
Froggy said:
That's close Froggy. The one I have is 500k BTU and has a trigger so you don't have to run so much gas through it when not heating something. Still it uses gas so fast that on a 90 degree day it can freeze a 20 pound tank solid in about 15 to 20 minutes. Let it thaw for an hour and in another 15 to 20 it's empty!
Fix
hmm yours sounds more versatile, what brand and make is it, I really want one that uses natural gas,I could hook it up to my house gas line...would solve the freezing problem and refill problem... Hey heres an idea, drill a hole in your cat between the honeycomb, add gas line and light the ends, step back, wait till nice roasty red, should blow out everything? :lol:
aflacglobal
Well-known member
You wont get as much heat per unit volume as you would with LPG.
