A passive stripping system

[Platdigger]

That's great Carroll!

What is the base metal the nuts were made of?
Randy

 

[Shecker]

If someone wishes to pm me I will send the pdf document on Recovery of copper and pm's from e-scrap and they can post it.

Randy in Gunnison

 

[P_CARROLL]

The base metals of the nuts is high strength steel.

 

[Platdigger]

But not stainless......right?
Randy

 

[Rag and Bone]

It would be great to have this process described with chemistry. I have seen plenty of anectodal evidence running test batches. I'm hoping this will lead to recovery of all PMs from whole boards.

 

[P_CARROLL]

But not stainless......right?
Randy

No not stainless.

 

[Scott2357]

An interesting document from Shecker...

 

[goldsilverpro]

Shecker,

Thanks for the Bureau of Mines RI. I collected those things for years, but I don't remember that one. After reading 100s of these, I must admit that I'm very leery of them. They're usually neat, tidy, and unique and they make you think, but they're most always impractical. Maybe this one is the lone exception. I'll hold off judgment until I read it.

Why didn't you post a copy of it to start with, or at least give your source? That would have saved 10 forum pages of BS and would have saved the hours of wasted time that Harold and I and others spent trying to figure this damned thing out.

 

[Shecker]

GSP the answer to that is remarkably simple. My wife packed in a box and forgot which one. I am still looking for other reports of the same venue, including the electrolytic regeneration of sulfuric acid for acido-copper sulfate leaching, and when I find it (in the great nether realm of my wife's packing) I will arrange for it to be posted. I just found a report of pilot studies in processing dental amalgm is anyone wants it.

Randy in Gunnison

 

[Blacktoadd]

In Mr Shecker's article I picked up on one thing I have seen. The first time I attempted to Melt down a nugget of copper I got the piece you see in the picture. The black is the untouched Nugget areas. You can see the places I scraped off are copper colored. The silvery looking areas are just that, Silvery areas. I have yet to acertain what the silvery material is. It is not lead unless it is alloyed with something to make it hard. it also does not tarnish. The copper was from a little experimenting with electrowinning of some copper chloride solution from leaching mixed content ore with HCl peroxide. Subsiquently melting left me with the coating over the nugget. I hesitate calling it dore.
The ore is of a type "Known to often contain significant quantities of gold and platinum grade metals.
I was getting back to the ore over the weekend. I started finding the Yellow/orange precipitate while not trying to drop platinum from solution. I added a little more peroxide to the nicely warmed mixture and started seeeing the precipitate forming on some of the small stones. then in the sand at the bottom of the glass container. About two tablespoons appeared while I was not lookng in a pint of solute. I have yet to determine what it is yet. It is insouable in hot water and I risned it twice. Settles quickly like platinum grade materials. Large clumps like platinum precipitate. I couldn't believe what I was reading in the article I have on my desk. Waiting to figure out what it is when I have more time and knowlege.

 

[Anonymous]

Gentlemen..Once you reach the point of a Dore with your material..has anyone thought about using flux and variable temps to induce the melt points of the individual PM's to extract each at its individual melt point??? thereby selective repat. with out elect. ???? CU repat.. i'll buy into your postulate here based on the current experiment I'm running just haven't decided how to attack the residue Dore to get out the PM's /....So plz lets continue down this road and see if we can reach a break thru together..After all if its controversial its probably worth the effort to see it thru and relish the outcome...thx Rick

 

[goldsilverpro]

The metals are in there as alloys and the phase diagrams are very complex. The metals aren't there as individual metals, except in rare combinations, and their individual melting points no longer apply.

In other words, what you are proposing absolutely won't work.

 

[Harold_V]

In other words, what you are proposing absolutely won't work.

That's correct. No more so than would hoping for gravity to separate each element because of specific gravity. Elements that will alloy are normally separated only with considerable difficulty. One exception might be silver and gold, which are easily parted from one another (chemically).

Harold

 

[Anonymous]

has anyone actually produced or concentrated metal with this process. I read the booklet download and it appears to me that they are using the
more common metals in boards to precipate copper from a copper sulfate solution - and my understanding the reason is to actually remove the aluminum, zinc, steel from the boards, leaving the copper that is replaced from the original solution, copper and higher metals still attached/contained on the board or parts that contain them.

Then they are burning/melting the entire solids - precipated copper and the remaining metal contents from the boards, into an impure copper ingot then eletrorefining that to recover the copper, with the precious metals left in anode bags as in the normal copper process.

So my impression is that if you are melting the copper from the first precipation you are only getting copper from your copper sulfate solution.

I should add, I do not want to be a nay sayer, I do want to use the process and only intended to explain what I got from the booklet so that someone could tell me what I am missing.







Now if you are adding H2O2 it may be different from the booklet process.

 

[Blacktoadd]

If you had ever been involved in the plating business you would have understood what what steve was doing when he was separating the silver from the copper and why the copper turned up on the back side of the cathode.
When you have a plating bath analized by the supplier, a service they provide if you are using all their stuff they tell you every little thing that is in the bath. and how to take care of it. EXAMPLE:you got a plating bath with Iron or what ever in it. The instruction may be something like "Dummy Bath at 10 amps/ sq ft for 24 hours.
When Steve was plating out the silver from the stirling he was plating out the silver on the front which was recieving the proper current density (correct number of amps per square inch for the solution) on the front facing the "ONE ANODE" he had" If he had had two anodes it wouldn't work. On the back of the sheet the current density was very low. Certain contaminating metals plate out of the parent bath at very low current densities. (Dummying). The correct current density for a bath to plate out good metal can be determined in a Hull Cell. from R.O. Hull Co.

 

[Blacktoadd]

So far, everything I know and have read is leading me to the direction of Recover all metals, smelt in a similar manner as used by the mills. They melt, blow in Oxygen/air to oxidize many metals (iron) vaporize some as found in the wild ore. Turn some into compounds that float. pour off cu from bottom or let harden and break off slag. This = "blister copper" about 95 to 98 % pure. Then electro-refine to tripple 9's. They have removed out almost all of the metals that will "dummy out" in low current areas. and use a bath that plates out smooth and clear, not one that plates out in powders and crystols that scrape off, which will contain some of the base metals. I am seeking information as to wheather or not I can smelt directly from Copper Chloride. NOTE: if you use a commercial electrorefining bath they will tell you how to maintain it. You will have ultimate success beyond your home endevors. You also want a large bath. Small baths go out of wack so quickly your head will spin. In a large bath not too heavily run, you send in regular samples and get to fix things before you are out of business.
Bruce

 

[Harold_V]

has anyone actually produced or concentrated metal with this process. I read the booklet download and it appears to me that they are using the
more common metals in boards to precipate copper from a copper sulfate solution - and my understanding the reason is to actually remove the aluminum, zinc, steel from the boards, leaving the copper that is replaced from the original solution, copper and higher metals still attached/contained on the board or parts that contain them.

That makes sense. The idea of parting copper that is drastically contaminated isn't a good one. By using copper sulfate to dissolve the base metals, they are eliminated from the mass. When the recovered copper is melted, the yield has the potential to be high quality copper , making the parting operation successful. I seem to recall that was one of the processes the bureau of mines was developing years ago.

Harold

 

[Blacktoadd]

I can't remember weather or not HCl peroxide or bleach will disolve silver.

I haven't taken time to check out what type of metal is covering the top part of the little piece of copper I Smelted from some of the oar I dug up. It is soft, doesn't tarnish, shiny silver, and I wonder why it didn't mix in. Most metals alloy with copper. Someday when I am farther along and am checking out such things I will.

 

[Gold Nut]

Hello Shecker,
Could you elaborate on this subject a little more ( It sounds interesting), and how is the process working for you on the e-scrap? Also, I don't want to sound like a dummy, but what exactly is CuSO4?
Gold Nut

 

[Catxyoli]

i usualy search wikipedia but sometimes it would not recognise the formula so i search a periodic table to know what's each atom name then again search wikipedia the name of mostly recognised compound and it should say in the page for Sodium for example it says mostluy comon forms of Sodium coumpounds ... etc...

the "codes" and formulas used here is another story but theres always someone to help specialy in processes
search search search ad refine refine refine lol