I am busy reading C.M.Hokes book at present
gold recovery
- Thread starter KAREL Charvat
- Start date
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There is no line breaks so it is basically just a bunch of words, so it is hard to read.
Can you see the difference between the one you posted and the one I adjusted?
Have you read C.M. Hokes book yet?
Edit to add:
Sorry, I did not see your reply on reading Hoke , it was on the next page.
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There is 2 things of concern here.
You did obviously not dissolve all the copper from solution, which in turn will mean you did not dissolve all the silver either?
Or did you leave the dissolved Copper and Silver in the solution and just added the HCl when you transitioned to AR?
This will result in a mix of Copper Nitrate and Silver Chloride, which in turn will be a Blueish black mud after some time.
But the Silver Chloride will form immediately upon adding the HCl.
Or if you accidentally used Bronze in the in-quartering, you may have formed metastannic acid which is a very hard to filter mud from the Nitric-Tin reaction.
How did you melt and quarter the Gold?
Did you cornflake it after?
You did obviously not dissolve all the copper from solution, which in turn will mean you did not dissolve all the silver either?
Or did you leave the dissolved Copper and Silver in the solution and just added the HCl when you transitioned to AR?
This will result in a mix of Copper Nitrate and Silver Chloride, which in turn will be a Blueish black mud after some time.
But the Silver Chloride will form immediately upon adding the HCl.
Or if you accidentally used Bronze in the in-quartering, you may have formed metastannic acid which is a very hard to filter mud from the Nitric-Tin reaction.
How did you melt and quarter the Gold?
Did you cornflake it after?
I have left dissolved Copper and Silver in solution and just added HCI.
For quartering I have used pure copper not Bronze.
Before smelting and quartering I have added pieces of gold and copper in crucible and smelted, during smelting I have been mixing it with stainless steel rod.
Than I pour it in container with cold water and get some flakes and small pieces of gold/copper.
For quartering I have used pure copper not Bronze.
Before smelting and quartering I have added pieces of gold and copper in crucible and smelted, during smelting I have been mixing it with stainless steel rod.
Than I pour it in container with cold water and get some flakes and small pieces of gold/copper.
Well then we can guess what the blue mud is. Its a mix of Silver Chloride and Copper Hydroxide along with other Hydroxides.
Filter off the clear liquid into a new container. Test it with stannous (acidify first) and if negative, set aside for a future stock pot and waste treatment.
To the filtrate cover with HCl and dissolve what can be dissolved, then wash throughly through a filter in dilute HCl until all is properly clean.
The solid should be clean (ish) Silver Chloride.
The new solution should contain your gold, but might contain Nitrates from the Nitric. So evaporate it down to get the solution more concentrated. Then heat it to around 80 Centigrade in a container no more than 1/3 full and add hot Sulfamic acid la little at the time, stir well and wait some time. When it no longer foams the Nitric is destroyed.
Now you can drop the Gold with your preferred method.
It needs another round of refining and you will want to make Silver of your Silver Chloride after.
As you have noticed we don’t like using Urea, it is not very effective and we have the risk of creating a somewhat explosive compound.
What lead you to think adding carbonate/bicarbonate was a good idea? Youtube?
Yes I get most info about acid refining on internet and it suggest to use urea and bicarb soda, I have used far to much of it.
Now I am left about 200grams of dry mud as I have sun dried my original solution, where gold input was 55g and 55g copper.
Do I have to wash dry mud with water again to get rid of access bicarb soda and urea and than to evaporate solution down to more concentrated.
Now I am left about 200grams of dry mud as I have sun dried my original solution, where gold input was 55g and 55g copper.
Do I have to wash dry mud with water again to get rid of access bicarb soda and urea and than to evaporate solution down to more concentrated.
The first major error was not pouring off the liquid from the first Nitric parting.
I have washed solution with water about 6 times, I mix it well, than I let it settle rinse of top liquid which is clearer, but blue color is still there.
On the bottom of glass container is thick liquid blue/light grey, I have tested solution for acid, it look there is no acid present. I am trying to get sulfamic acid, so far no luck, that is Madagascar.
I have before used REFINET Fumeless and I only needed nitric acid, that was simple
Do you have a picture of the beaker?
Well if you have no access of Sulfamic acid we have two options.
Number one, do not add mire Nitric than needed (first option always
)Let the Nitric be used up by adding sacrificial material, Gold or Copper is ok.
Try to wash with HCl and see if you can clean it more like that.
Your mud should be SilverChloride, a white powder that turns grey with time/light.
But as always, acidify the liquid and test with stannous.
PS!
Sulfamic acid is used to clean grout for tiles. So a tile shop may have it.
I have tested liquid which I syphoned out this morning after numerous washing, test for gold was negative, dip cot ton in solution and add two drops of stannous chloride, it foam little but did not change color, white.
Than I did same with solution in beacon after adding stannous chloride it foam bit and after about 2 minutes turn black, you my be able to see on enclose photo of beacon with solution.
During washing this morning I stirred and shake solution well, all lumps were dissolved, this afternoon it form lumps of mud again.
Than I did same with solution in beacon after adding stannous chloride it foam bit and after about 2 minutes turn black, you my be able to see on enclose photo of beacon with solution.
During washing this morning I stirred and shake solution well, all lumps were dissolved, this afternoon it form lumps of mud again.
Attachments
What is the pH of the solution you tested?
No idea, but I have decanted liquid from glass container and on bottom I found perfectly round about 1cm diameter solid chunks of mud, I tested one of them with stannous chloride and it turn white for a moment and then grey/black.
Liquid and mud on test show presence of gold.
You can not test solids with stannous.
When you are perfectly sure there are no more salts that dissolve in water,
you will have to switch to HCl and see what is left after thorough washing with HCl.
When all this is done, you should be left with white greyish Silver Chloride.
Set this aside but keep it wet.
Your Gold should now be in the liquid fraction.
Make sure it is acidic and not too dilute, you may need to evaporate off a bit of the solution.
Then you have two options, precipitate or cement it out on solid Copper.
I have removed all white/grey deposits to different glass container and test for gold, none appeared to be there, than I teste my blue mud and show traces of gold.
I have also added some copper to blue solution for about 6 hrs. it did not show any reaction to solution, so I presume there is no nitric or HCI present.
I am left with 300ml of thick lumpy liquid. What is next move.
Yesterday I received on my mail discussion about refining of gold and surprisingly people were advocating using urea in process, very confusing.
Did you acidify your solution before testing and cementing?
I did not touch it, I have just wash it and separate it, add no other chemicals.
Please understand that I am not chemist, I am technical man, all this is new for me and I am now learning thru this forum and studying CM Hokes book.
What I learn from internet led to disaster and I do not want to repeated it , that is why I my be asking lot of stupid question.
The stannous test and all other procedures work best if the solution is acidic.
How did you clean your Silver Chloride? Water only?
You need to wash it in HCl, to dissolve copper salts and other salts.
So you have clean Silver Chloride and ensure all the Gold salts are dissolved again.
I have washed solution with water only, than white/grey sediments separated by syphoning it out of solution. How much of HCI I have to use and for how long to leave solution to work.
