Refining Gold from Gold Filled Jewelry

[Oneal58]

Thanks OZ, Palladium.
I did as advised, I found that even after 2 days of sitting open, I still had some chlorine in solution, thank goodness.
I added another 1/3 of distilled water to the main batch. I then put the vessel on low heat on the stove. Just enough I could see a little steam rising from solution. I left solution on the stove until the extra water I added was evaporated away. I started getting worried again but decided to let the vessel stay on heat a while longer.
It didn't happen all at once but I started to see fine particles of gold accumulating on the bottom of the vessel. I would stir the solution and the little pile of fine gold in the center/bottom of the vessel would get bigger and bigger.
As time went on I ended up with a complete and successful drop with solution testing negative.
Thank you so much for your help, I feel much better now and a lot of worry is off of me. Thank goodness I didn't have to explain to the gentleman what had happened. He hasn't came around for the last few days but I expect him today. I have left the drop in the vessel to show him before I finish with the refine.
It sure takes a lot of plated items to make any kind of show, I hope he will be happy with his returns.
Thank you all again.
Oneal

 

[butcher]

Oneal, explain to him how gold always looks like more than is actually there, if you melted the powders in front of him he could see the gold shrink into a button.

I am glad your back out and refining, I seen your post but you already had some great guy's helping with your question, so I did not chime in.

Are we going to get to see a picture of the melted gold?

 

[Oneal58]

Hi Butcher, it's good to hear from you old Buddy.
Butcher, I wanted the gentleman there during the melt, just as you advised. It is very important to me not to have anyone think I would ever take from them. I know how easily it is for someone to become suspicious of a gold refiner when returns aren't what they expect them to be?
And of course, as I expected, he was disappointed. I have made a decision that I will never, ever refine gold plated again, ever, for someone other than myself. I honestly believe the man walked away thinking I had in some way stolen from him. Something I would never do to anyone. I blame myself partly because I didn't warn him or fully explain to him how little gold is on gold plated items. His expectations were high and returns were low. So he was very disappointed, as I was also, for him.
From now on it's just Karat Gold Refining for anyone who wants me to refine for them. The variables are just too complex to give someone a correct estimate on what returns will be on gold plated items. I know I could get close but it would just take too much time to get the estimate close. I even considered adding some of my own gold to his just so he would be satisfied and not suspicious of me having done something shady.
I can test, then estimate what returns should be on karat gold. Getting pretty close on what returns should be most times, if I don't mess up somewhere.
But I have to ask myself, do I want to even refine for the public. With my personality, I think I would lose too much sleep over it. I would probably end up working for nothing, as I did in this case. Not even considering the cost to me for chemicals, electricity, Etc;.
I can understand this gentleman's feelings. He had been collecting these gold plated items for many years. He had developed a mind set that he really thought he had something of great value there over the years. I picked up on his feelings he had become attached to the material. But it was too late to back out of the refine by the time I felt I was in trouble with him, or his expectations.
I worry about what he may be saying within the community about this experience.
But I know I did everything I possibly could to get the best returns for him I possibly could. I can rest and feel good about that. But it also worries me that after I seen how disappointed he was with the returns that he may be saying something negative about the experience to others?
Oh well, nothing I can do about that now. I did the best I could for him. Hopefully, I will stop worrying about this eventually.
Butcher, I have been really busy on other things for the last week or so. As soon as I can get to the stored up chemicals project I will get with you seeking your help.
Thanks Butcher, as always your insight and advice is spot on. It is always appreciated and respected.
Thank You,
Oneal
Oh, almost forgot to post a picture of the button that has caused all the worrying. I am pretty sure I did get close to at least .99 on this one, maybe a little better. It pulled a deep pipe and has the right color. I have had pretty good results with the sulphuric cell buttons turning out good, (Knock on Wood!).Worried about changing my luck, NOT ME???
But I have only ran a few with the cell. And this one will more than likely be the last one for a while? But I was impressed with the HCL/CL method I used on this one. But for the hickup with the left over CL I had on this one.

 

[butcher]

O’Neal, that is beautiful, a job well done, I would not worry much, you were honest, You know it, and he has pure gold in his hand, he probably would have had a hard time finding any one to sell the raw material to who would give him as much as you have given him, he just does not know how lucky he is,
Also if he Honestly understood how much trouble you went through to refine this for him he would probably not be able to pay you for all of it with that pretty button of gold, you have learned a lot, and that experience is worth more than that yellow metal.

O’Neal it has been a pleasure to help you with a few questions, and I feel I have gained a good friend while doing it.

Congratulations on a very fine job.

 

[Oneal58]

Butcher,
I am proud to call you my friend. My friend Butcher, even though I have never meet you face to face. I feel I know you better than if I would have lived next door to you most my life.
Butcher without you, that little button of gold, which has caused me so much worry. But at the same time has put a sense of pride and self worth back in my life again. All would have been impossible without you holding my hand and showing me the way, from the very first here on the Forum.
And let me just say this, when you say you have just helped/answered just a few questions for me? With that way of thinking I sure wish you owed me just a few dollars. I would be the richest man in town :lol:
Of course we don't know each other's stories or where someone is at during a particular point in their walk through this life.
It would take a Novel to explain to you what my story is. And maybe the same for you? But try to understand this, with me, it has never been truely just about the Gold Buttons. The reasons for this endeavor run much, much, deeper than the gold buttons. I am sure you understand what I am trying to say.
But, I am just getting back in the house for tonight. I am getting too old to be doing this night owl stuff again this late in life. That's what the wife says anyway, and as you have always said, the wife always knows best. :shock:
Thank you my friend and good night.
Your Friend,
Oneal

 

[Oneal58]

Butcher, hope you are doing well today.
I have a question for you, hoping you can help me with. Of course I keep testing solutions on hand up to 22K Gold testing solutions and also Platinum testing solutions. I make my own solutions now but I would like to be able to tell what Karat Gold I have using the density measurement test. That's the only way I see right now for me to be able to see if I can determine if I have 24K without having a piece assayed. I have read up a little on Fire Assaying but only having a piece or 2 of Platinum now and then I need to spend most my time reading and studying the main subject, which of course is gold recovery right now.
I would need to purchase a set of (Ohaus Cent-O-Gram scales) which would set me back over $100 to do the density test correctly. I have studied the density process and understand it but I was wondering if the investment in the scales is worth it, or not? Will using these scales for the density test tell you if you have 24K gold that's reliable, if test is done correctly? I guess what I am asking is how accurate is the density test? Or is the only ture way to determine if you have 24K is to have the piece assayed? Is there another way to check density without having to have the Ohaus scales?
I have a couple of sets of small scales but only the smallest set that can be used for legal trade. This set will only test up to 20 grams. Plus they are not designed for use around water. I guess I could rig up a reverse weight measurement system (not knowing the correct name for the method) a (Jury Rig) and use the precision scales to weigh the piece while it's underwater. Or Is there another way of testing to see if your gold is 24K without sending it out to be assayed?
Oh, I have one more question Butcher. I have another ring that looks like Platinum. I have done a Platinum test with Platinum solution which the large ring passes. I also put the ring into pure Nitric and then into cold Aqua Regia for a couple of hours. Neither of these solutions had any effect on the ring, none. I didn't want to heat the AR due to the outside chance I could mess it (Ring) up if it turned out to be 800 parts platinum.
I never did invest in a little pure platinum to make that testing solution, I didn't think I would be messing with Pt. so I didn't buy the pure pt. samples needed.
I guess I could file enough filings off the ring to make a testing solution but I hate to do that. Also, if the ring turns out to be something else I would be wasting my time. What process do you use to test for Pt. without having it dissolved in solution? And, if you don't have any pure platinum on hand. Is there another process that I can use? Or I just need to order the Pure Platinum samples to make the testing solution?
Butcher, I read that I can submerge the ring in hydrogen peroxide and if I get hydrogen bubbles released it is Platinum.
I went ahead and did this test, the ring did bubble in the Hydrogen Peroxide.
After all this I found a name on the Ring, I googled it and believe there's a possibility that it could be a metal that a manufacturer is calling Saladium? Says it has a lot of properties similar to stainless steel. Do you know if Stainless would bubble in Hydrogen Peroxide? I do know stainless will not dissolve on a scratch stone with 22K gold testing solution or Platinum testing solution. Just don't know if it will bubble in Hydrogen Peroxide or not?
So, I am stuck I guess, I guess what I will have to do is just put the item up or order the sample pieces of platinum? That is if (Saladium) test positive as Platinum would in the test I preformed on it?
Thanks so much Butcher for your time and help.
Oneal

 

[nickvc]

Try the ring in hot hydrochloric if it possesses the same or similar metals to stainless it should start to dissolve which platinum certainly will not.
Gold is never totally pure and in my opinion the only test is an assay but they do it in reverse for high purity metals, they look for impurities and deduct those from the result I believe.

 

[goldsilverpro]

Are you sure it isn't spelled Siladium? That's a stainless alloy used for cheap class rings. The specific gravity of that would be around 7.9.

http://www.google.com/search?q=siladium+alloy&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&client=firefox-a

 

[Lobby]

I just read this entire thread this morning. What a fascinating read.

As someone who's soon to process some GF jewelry, it's been quite enlightening.

Thanks to all who've posted.

 

[butcher]

Oneal,
I really could not help with this question's, I am sure glad we have more knowledgeable professionals here who can help us.

I have never heard of siladium (stainless steel), besides the hot HCl Nickvc suggested, and the specific gravity test GSP suggested, I remember Irons and Lou talking about using a torch (if I remember correctly), PGM alloy's glow white hot in a reducing flame, other (white) metals oxidize in flame turning colors.

I also believe the specific gravity test would give an idea of the materials involved, but would be very inaccurate to tell how pure the gold button is, too many variables for that fine of a weight difference to be measured, a tiny air bubble, dust particles when gold measured in air, slight difference in temperature, type of setup apparatus, scale being able to measure such an extremely minute amount of difference in weight, (even the most expensive lab scales may have a hard time trying to tell impurity in the atoms of gold), and so on make this an impossible task to tell impurity in the atoms of gold that make up the button.

The pipe in your gold is a good indication of its purity.

I feel (but do not know) even an assay could not tell how many atoms of other metals are involved in contaminating the gold atoms, but give a general Idea of its purity.
I do not know but also believe even an assay can also be fairly inaccurate at telling the exact purity of the gold (but can give a good indication, and is a very good method), as it seems to me there can also be many variables in performing the assay, if we are thinking atoms of contamination of the pure gold.

Nick you mentioned you think they done the assay in reverse, for high purity gold, it would be interesting to learn more about that process.

 

[nickvc]

Butcher if I remember correctly it was in a post by one of our pros GSP, Lou or 4metals who described the process, I can't remember the details but I'm sure one of them can give details if my memory is correct, i'm far from an expert on assaying techniques I'm afraid but I think once a certain point in fineness is reached it becomes inaccurate after that point. My apologies if my memory is incorrect on this

 

[Oneal58]

Thanks Everyone for your time and your post, they are all appreciated.
I guess the best thing to do is learn enough about refining and do enough refines so you will know when you have 24K.
Then let the pro's who only assay worry about the fineness of the metal when and if they need to. Just do the very best job you possibly can on a refine and if it doesn't turn out right, do it again. Thanks everyone.
Butcher, I will try the white hot glow heat test, just to see what happens. I am suspicious now it's Siladium since reading the information on Google that Goldsilverpro sent me. So, I am pretty sure we don't have to worry about it being Platinum.
Butcher, I am going to do the read by (4Metals) you directed me to over the weekend. Butcher, I hope to start on the Soup of Chemicals next week. I sure hope nothing pops up, I am looking forward to it. I know, with your guidance, I will learn a ton. I have got to get a few things together per your instructions. So, I won't bother you buddy with my questions until I am on the project.
Oh well, I lied Butcher. I do have a question. You mentioned a while back that there are many different grades of stainless steel. What grade and thickness do I need to try and find for the project? Using the size bucket you recommended?
Thanks Butcher.
Nickvc, I will try the HCL boil to see what happens also. Thanks Nickvc
Goldsilverpro, the name on the ring is very hard to decipher but it very well could be spelled Siladium. I read the info. on Google you sent the URL to. I am thinking there's a very good chance that's exactly what I have. But I am going to do the suggested test, just to try and verify, as best I can.
Thanks, Goldsilverpro
Question to Anyone who would know? Does or will stainless steel glow white if heated as Platinum will as Butcher mentioned trying? I guess I could round up a piece of stainless and try it. I got to have some stainless stock anyway, but it's always good for me to know someone else has seen the results before hand.
Welcome aboard Lobby, I haven't been here long myself. You have literally found a Gold Mine of Knowledge here on this forum. Lobby, I still can't get over the fact that all this knowledge is given freely with no strings attached. Well, maybe 1 string, you will probably end up with some very good friends, as I have.
Thanks Everyone,
Oneal

 

[butcher]

Question : “You mentioned a while back that there are many different grades of stainless steel. What grade and thickness do I need to try and find for the project? Using the size bucket you recommended?”

Oneal, I must admit I do not remember what we were talking about when you mention a stainless steel bucket, or what purpose you intend to use it, some stainless steel is magnetic and will corrode easily, I really do not even consider these as stainless.

The non magnetic types hold up well to corrosion, like 304 and 316 although I would keep them away from HCL, here is some Google info on stainless steel:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=nonmagnetic+grades+of+stainless+steel&gbv=2&oq=nonmagnetic+grades+of+stainless+steel&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_l=hp.12...1469l19128l0l20987l39l39l0l24l0l0l156l1610l8j7l15l0.frgbld.

Sorry I do have a bad memory. What are you going to do with the stainless steel bucket?


“Question to anyone who would know? Does or will stainless steel glow white if heated as Platinum will as Butcher mentioned trying? I guess I could round up a piece of stainless and try it. I got to have some stainless stock anyway, but it's always good for me to know someone else has seen the results before hand.”

When I have heated nonmagnetic stainless steel with a torch it would turn a kind of rainbow bluish color, sorry never tried a torch on platinum, but I hope to one day.

 

[Oneal58]

Hi Butcher, it was in your post about recycling my waste solutions. Your quote was,
"And a piece of non-magnetic stainless steel, for a cathode, I would also do this in 5 gallon bucket.
Large pieces of metals to fit bucket and give large flat surface area."
I was just wondering what series of stainless steel would work best for the cathode?
But anyway, It seems every time I get ready to start on this Butcher something else pops up. When I can get to the waste solutions I will just get with you again.
Here is what is pressing now,
There is a friend of mine who owns a computer service in a nearby town. He asked me if I would be interested in refining his circuit boards, chips, Etc;, that he has accumulated.
I told him I would give it a try to see how it goes.
I wanted to do a test run on some fingers, trimmed close. I ran 200 grams of closely trimed double sided fingers in a batch of HCL/CL. About half of the fingers were small and the other half was medium sized. I got a good return on the foils out of the 200 grams, or so I thought, at first.
When I put HCL into the foils, the once fair amount of fingers seemed to disappear in front of my eyes. After 3 washes in HCL I ended up with about 1/2 of what I started with before the HCL washes.
I wanted to see exactly what amount of gold was in the 200 grams so I went ahead and ran the making gold pure process.
I ended up with a good looking nugget, trouble is, it's only a little over 1/2 gram. I remember you saying something about electronic scrap here a while back that lead me to believe you process electronic scrap. If I am wrong about this I guess I didn't remember correctly.
My second question for tonight Butcher is,
Is this return anywhere near normal for 200 grams of small and medium sized fingers lot? The little button looks as good as any I have turned out and I believe it's near 24K. But I am wondering If this is a normal return or I am definetly doing something wrong somewhere and losing gold? I did the stannous test after each wash and detected no gold lose in the decants?
[b]My last question is this[/b],
I left a window open and it rained and messed up my copper sulfate. The store I bought the old bag from started getting in a new kind. I am going to load a picture of this copper sulfate, it is a bright blue color. No green color at all. The picture is below. On the bag it says it is (99.0% copper sulfate pentahydrate). I am wondering if this is OK to use to drop gold with?
As always Butcher thank you for your help. It is very much appreciated.
Thanks, Oneal
[img]http://web.ftc-i.net/~danni1/sulfate1.JPG

 

[butcher]

Oneal,

You mentioned processing memory fingers in HCl/Cl, did you remove the gold plating as foils with HCl/3% peroxide first. Which also removes copper from the foils, before dissolving the gold foils in HCl and bleach?

The gold foils are removed from the memory fingers circuit board with HCl and 3% peroxide, before dissolving gold with HCL/Bleach.

When I process electronic scrap I do not calculate yields, I believe other members state 1.6gram to 2.5grams per pound of close cut memory fingers, I cannot verify these figures.

Copper sulfate is not used to precipitate gold, copper sulfate could be used to refine copper in an electrolytic cell, and it is also used to kill roots in sewer lines. This is not used in refining gold, although I have made copper sulfate as a byproduct of recovering gold.


Copperas or also called Ferrous sulfate or iron sulfate (FeSO4) is made from iron and sulfuric acid, it is a green crystal when made fresh, green crystals will precipitate gold, or test for gold in solution.
If the ferrous sulfate is oxidized in air it turns brown and will no longer work to precipitate gold. The name copperas has nothing to do with copper. I believe this is what you’re thinking of in using to precipitate gold.

I think the name has you a bit confused here.

 

[Oneal58]

Hi Butcher,
You are right on all counts, as usual. I didn't mention the first step on removing the foils with HCL/3% Peroxide first before the HCL/CL.
As far as when I went to the hardware to buy the Ferrous Sulfate, (SULFATE) was all I seen when I looked at the package. Glad the crystals were Blue and I asked you before I used any of the Copper Sulfate. I don't know what I was thinking, had a lot going on but that just lets me know to be very careful from now on.
I can't forget, if I happen to make a mistake with different chemicals there could be a dangerous reaction. I need to keep this in the fore front of my mind at all times.
Butcher I am now working the many different types of CPU Chips. I didn't realize that there were that many different kinds of chips. Some have the solder on them that I have read contains a high content of gold. Others have no solder that I can see on them. Some are made of ceramic which i busted up good, others are just made of fiber that has what looks to be a stainless steel cover over the internal silicon chip, others have gold lids, some have no covers at all on them. I have a broad selection of chips made all over the world? I don't think that I have enough of each to run them seperately.
Can I just take the ones that have the stainless steel covers off with my knife (pryed them off)? Is the silicon that is holding this lid/cover on have gold in it? I have taken all the processor chips off the boards and opened all of the chips up. some just have gold pins on them. Some of these chips have gold pins on them that are only 1/32 to maybe 1/16" of pins showing out of the fiber board. I was thinking to just process the pins and save the boards to sell once I have enough that a refinner would be interested in. I was thinking of taking my dremmel and cutting the very tops of the short pins off and then cutting the pins right on top of the fiber chip. This I am thinking, tell me if I am wrong, would keep the majority of the KOVAR out of the refining batch. Which would also allow the acids used to get inside of the pins to strip the gold. Or am I off base completely here. Or the pins even gold plated inside?
Maybe as time goes on I may become competent enough to try and recover the other PM's that are in the componets on the boards.
This is my first try at this, other than my disappointing returns from the fingers I processed. I got a total of .5 grams of gold from196 grams of fingers trimmed very closely. Just too much work for too little return and then have to divide that up. Not even enough to cover the chemicals used? Now, if I had 10 times that amount trimmed fingers, that might be worth all the work involved?
Just wanted to hear what your thoughts on this would be before I make anymore mistakes.
Oh, I have one more question. There is a square looking piece of silicone on some of the chips under the cover. Do I want to break this silicone/glass like piece up before stripping? I don't see any gold under the lid, just a piece of what looks to be a glass like cover over a white metal foil that looks to be a platinum color?
As always, thanks Butcher, Any direction here would be appreciated.
Thanks Butcher, Oneal

 

[butcher]

It has been a long time since I have done any CPU's.

I would process ceramic and fiber type separately.

A propane torch will burn off oils; remove lids and can help to burn of heat-sink compound (that you did not get completely wiped of before-hand). The torch can also help to remove pins from the fiber CPU’s.

A pair of needle nose pliers to grab the heated CPU, a bang on the table to knock off unsoldered pins or lids, or a paint scrapper to push then off.

The pin and fiber chips I would use hydrochloric acid and 3% peroxide, to remove base metals (Kovar), this can be done in canning jars, the small pins take time as the tube of gold with the sealed end is hard for the acid to get inside with bubbles trying to escape the tube, make sure tubes are hollow (float or swirl easy in jar before trying to dissolve the gold foil, You can then use HCl and bleach for the gold, the fiber board I usually incinerated after the process and peeled apart the layers of fiberglass, and to gain access to and process the metal between them.

The ceramics can be processed in Hydrochloric acid with additions of sodium or potassium nitrate (poor mans aqua regia), or with nitric acid and then aqua regia, or even HCl and bleach, just make sure there are none of the lids or heat sinks added, I usually break them to small pieces and leach them, (I would later then powder the ceramic and re-leach them again, others say there is no benefit to powdering them) the powders settle so frequent stirring is needed, also they need good stirring and rinsing after leaching.

 

[Oneal58]

Active Member


Posts: 202

Joined: November 4th, 2011, 1:16 am

Location: S.C.



April 23rd, 2012, 2:49 pm

Re: Refining Gold from Gold Filled Jewelry

Hi Butcher, I messed up when I replied to you on my last post. I hit the quote button on the bottom of the page and I don't think my last post showed up as a new post so I am going to delete the post that I hit the quote button and post this reply again. Maybe you will find it this time, sorry, I don't know what I was thinking when I did what you asked about previously.
But You are right on all counts, as usual. I didn't mention the first step on removing the foils with HCL/3% Peroxide first before the HCL/CL.
As far as when I went to the hardware to buy the Ferrous Sulfate, (SULFATE) was all I seen when I looked at the package. Glad the crystals were Blue and I asked you before I used any of the Copper Sulfate. I don't know what I was thinking, had a lot going on but that just lets me know to be very careful from now on.
I can't forget, if I happen to make a mistake with different chemicals there will be consequences. I need to keep this in the forefront of my mind at all times.
Butcher I am now working the many different types of CPU Chips. I didn't realize that there were that many different kinds of chips. Some have the solder on them that I have read contains a high content of gold. Others have no solder that I can see on them. Some are made of ceramic which i busted up good, others are just made of fiber that has what looks to be a stainless steel cover over the internal silicon chip that looks like it has a gold colored solder around the edges of the square piece, which I think is the silicon chip? Others have gold lids, some have no covers at all on them. I have a broad selection of chips made all over the world but not a lot of any of them? I don't think that I have enough of each to run them seperately.
I took the the ones that have the stainless steel covers off with my knife (pryed them off)? Is the silicon around the edges that is holding this lid/cover on have gold in it or is this the heat sink silicon that you are talking about? I have taken all the processor chips off the boards and opened all of the chips up. Some just have gold pins on them. Some of these chips have gold pins on them that are only 1/32 to maybe 1/16" of pins showing out of the fiber board. I was thinking to just process these pins and save the boards to sell once I have enough that a refiner would be interested in. I was thinking of taking my dremmel and cutting the very tops of the short pins off and then cutting the pins right on top of the fiber chip. This I am thinking, tell me if I am wrong, would keep the majority of the KOVAR out of the refining batch. Which would also allow the acids used to get inside of the pins to strip the gold plating? Or am I off base completely here. Or the pins even gold plated inside?
Maybe as time goes on I may become competent enough to try and recover the other PM's that are in the componets on the boards.
This is my first try at this, other than my disappointing returns from the fingers I processed. I got a total of .5 grams of gold from196 grams of fingers trimmed very closely. Just too much work for too little return and then have to divide that up. Not even enough to cover the chemicals used? Now, if I had 20 times that amount trimmed fingers, that might be worth all the work involved?
Just wanted to hear what your thoughts on this would be before I make anymore mistakes.
Oh, I have one more question. There is a square looking piece of silicone on some of the chips under the cover. Do I want to break this silicone/glass like piece up before stripping? I don't see any gold under the lid, just a piece of what looks to be a glass like cover over a white metal foil that looks to be a platinum color?
I need to ask another probably stupid question here. why can't I strip the gold off all the chips together with AR or HCl/Peroxide or a weak Nitric solution?
One more question Butcher and I will let you rest.
I read that I can take 2 pieces of iron pipe. One of the pieces is just a little smaller than the other. It will silde into the other piece of pipe but will be fairly tight. I have read I can take the boards, chips, Etc;, and put them into a stainless steel pot, drill holes at the bottom of the stainless steel pot and place it in a bed of charcoal. I can then take a fan, small fan and bring the heat up enough so that the internal electronics will bake to the point that when I take the two pieces of pipe that has been welded shut on each end with a thick steel base. Use this as a tool to crush up the material to a fine power. Then use several or more washes with water to pan off all the non metalics, run a good magnet through the metal and then after I am sure I have all the non metallic material and fibers, foreign materials out of PM.s use AR to recover the gold out of this material.
Does this sound vialble to you or it this something that would be a waste of my time?
Excuse me Butcher, I see where you directed me to powder the chips in your previous post.
As always, thanks Butcher, Any direction here would be appreciated.
Thanks Butcher, Oneal

 

[butcher]

I use about a 3" pipe about 12" long I welded a steel bottom on it, then a piece of pipe 11/4" 18" long with pipe caps on both ends, this homemade mortar and pestle to break the ceramic chips, I did not try heating them first, you can only break one at a time, they are hard and the surface are of the chip to hammer makes this a lot of work (and if you crush them to powder as I do after the first leach, it is a lot of work).


I would not strip the ceramic processors with the fiber board processors, the fiberboard CPU's have kovar pins this and the lead and tin solder would give you troubles, if you tried to process them with your ceramic CPU's in solutions to dissolve gold.

The fiber chips I would remove base metals using HCl and 3% H2O2 first.
We Know how much trouble the tin is in our solutions.

There is a recent discussion of processing the fiber type CPU's,
http://goldrefiningforum.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=9693

How is that Grandbaby doing growing like a weed I would bet.

 

[Oneal58]

Hi Butcher,She is here right now, she says Hey. I can hardly type most times with her sitting in my lap but that's OK, I manage. She pretty much hangs with her PaPa every single day she can. She doesn't like me working with the refining, she keeps walking over half-way to the old house and calling me until I have to stop what I am doing, step to the door and let her know I am OK. I guess this is my fault, I instilled in her and my grandson how dangerous what I do and how it will cause them harm. And never, no matter what to go over to where I am working. That it was just too dangerous to get close to where I am. Now she worries about me all the time. But, I will have to admit, it feels good and brings a smile to my face each time she does this. She doesn't give up, she will call me constantly until I step out and give her an answer. She is going to be a sharp little thing and is growing like a weed.
I hope you and your family are doing well also, tell them I said Hey as well Butcher.
But anyway, I could go on (bragging), Those but I need to get back to the refining. You say you haven't tried the heating method of the chips yet? From what I can find out (research) the ceramic chips break up really easily if first heated with the charcoal method. I will give it a try when I have time and let you know how it goes. If it works, it sure would save a lot of work.
Butcher do you think that this method would work with the fiber chips/boards as well. I know there will be some very toxic smoke that comes from doing this but it seems that if the process works what you would be left with would be just the metals that were in the fiber chips. Then process the remaining metals after they cool/ treat with the HCL/and H202 as you advised. Then go on with the refining from there. If this would work it sure would be better than trying to seperate all the crushed fiber material from the fiber chips by water and panning? I read a post of yours previously that you said you seperated the layers of the fiber chips to get at the metal between the layers of the fiber material. Do you think to burn all the fiberous material away would take so much heat that it would melt or fuse the remaining metals, or would it matter? Or just make one big mess? Holes were drilled all the way around the stainless steel vessel about 2 inches up from the bottom so the smoke would exit the bottom of the vessel.
I have even read that all the boards, chips, Etc;, incinerated and what metals that were left were then processed from there.
But I am going to follow your advice and if it works out that I have a lot of elecronic scrap from computers and if there is any money to be made I may look at some methods to process in bulk amounts? If It works out and I have bulk amounts of electronic scrap to process it sure would take a lot of the work out of processing a lot of material.
Right off the top of your head do you know how the large bulk processers go about processing their chips, boards, Etc;?
Let me know your thoughts on this Butcher.
As always, thanks Butcher for any advice and insight.
Oneal