***** The Platinumill Exposed and on Trial *****

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I figure it would come down to mostly a numbers game. cost to do production, amount of cats that can be done per time, time it takes to process, and cost to rid of waste, and ultimately the end recovery from the process

anyone have these rough numbers. oh and thanks froggy for getting this info started. would be pretty tough to beat $1 a gallon and not to mention it's renewable.
 
Determination of Platinum, Palladium,
Rhodium and Titanium in Automotive
Catalytic Converters :arrow:
 

Attachments

  • Determination of Platinum, Palladium,.pdf
    285.4 KB
lou,

I will not question your use with copper for pulling pgms out of the substrate vs. lead. As far I know this process is much, much, easier and safer and percentage wise its the best for recovering metals. This theory of leaching is tried but not a true way to go if you are trying to be cost effective with it. You are better off selling them for street value because you will basically break even with this method. Also, has anyone found a refiner willing to buy the sludge here in this forum? Has anyone got any quotes as far as how much it will cost to run a icp assay on this material? You guys do not understand what you are getting into seriously...................Its not cost effective you will see all of your profits start to go down the drain in this process you have chosen to call the best way to get pgms out of cat material. Its by far the most ineffective way out there as far as overhead expenses are concerned. Yeah the solutions are reusable but you still need to strengthen the solution again with more CLS 26p or whatever it still never ends. Also you have neutralized the solution by bringing the ph down with hydrozine or sodium bicarbonate but this DOES NOT RENDER THIS SOLUTION DISPOSABLE TO THE DRAIN BY ANY MEANS!!!!! You are STILL draining hazardous waste down city drains and they will find you and fine you for this soon it doesnt take long. You also need a permit (california) I dont know if this applies in your state most likely it does. Oh and another thing, do you really want to spend 8 -10 hrs a day leaching to get a result? thats half a day and then you still dont see your true results. You have rhodium in your solution still that you havent recovered. By firing the substrate its quicker more recovery %. Whatever you all decide to do great. We will see which method prevails mine or yours and thats when you all really do something instead of talking on this forum about the ten million other ways to leach whether it be with AR, Halogen salts, HCL, Nitric Acid, Sulfuric acid and what ever clever mixes that are used. Bottom line you will be sad with your outcomes. Mike from action shows you a video on leaching but doesnt take you further because he himself knows that leaching is not the way to get full recovery of your pgms. Just call him and ask him this question you will hear it for yourself. Hes in the business to sell you a theory and kilns, ovens, carbon plates, mining equip. etc. Thats why if you pay attention hes saying with the rest of the cat combs to dry them and send the comb to a refiner so they will be happy to refine your combs further because you cannot i repeat CANNOT get it all out with these mentioned methods of extraction. I will write a book if this method I decide to use goes smoothly. I will let this forum know my progress throughout the entire testing. I will have photos to post also something I havent done yet on this forum. Getting burned with the PLATINUMILL has taught me the expensive way. I have talked with countless refineries,miners,chemists etc. And so far this method IS the way to go. Time will tell. Good luck to you all. Stay tuned......................

Rob
 
Rob, your constant closed viewpoint aired out is getting old, its one thing to give a view point, but it appears you are the God given authority on what to do with cats all of the sudden, (Its not that I am smart, I just stay with problems longer! Albert Einstein)Plz. explain to me why most all the mine companies in the Entire World LEACH the ore???? Mike at action mining is not an expert in leach, the guy I talked to today IS the main chemist at DOW ( yes thats right "THE MAN") He really knows whats currently going on in leaching ore or cats,,,, have some patience and dont run out and buy anything just yet, throwing money at things will not produce the best results. He said Rh is not as hard to get out as everyone thinks, its just most small timers do not have the right temp,ph, or formula,, there are a few complex leach's that will get out over 99% of all metals in an ore/substrate. Have you read the rocky ledge testing data? Have you interpreted this data and its findings? Do you know how a resin pulls specific pgm's from an ionic state? Do you know or have you studied the specific effects of the many resins that are available , why and how they can choose the specific targeted metal and ignore all other including organics(ie. carbon etc) resins are amazing products that old timers know nothing about...Do you understand what I mean by a solution being loaded and pregnant, and if it is fully pregnant how to test for it? Have you studied one I ota' besides someones web page thats trying to sell you something? Look, you bought a piece of crap and now your the expert, Sorry but losing money doesnt make you the authority on any subject, it just makes me wonder what foolish act you may make in the future,(Sometimes one pays most for the things one gets for nothing! A.E)) good luck Shakes, you'll need it. Oh, and thanks whoever changed the Title, Excellent.. Frog
 
Sorry, Its just that the significant problem he has cannot be solved at the same level of thinking from which he created it.. :D Hmmm........I will leave ya'll with this, i'm getting some sleep tonight!!
 

Attachments

  • acidic halogen leach resin solutions.pdf
    2.2 MB
HAHAHA....get a load of this new title.!....:)

OK, resins are great, the right ones, used the right way, will work.

But hey, lets get everything into solution first.

I mean if the resin has nothing to collect.....whats the point.

I think once we get a successful leach, we can check our results with something simple like zinc, or even hydrazine.

Then once we know we are 90 percent or better at recovery......a guy could start thinking about these exotic resins and the like......yea?
Randy
 
Concerning the download "Determination of Platinum, Palladium,
Rhodium and Titanium in Automotive
Catalytic Converters"
BTW thank you for this Aflac!

What is mg g−1?

mg is micrograms, is g-1 kilograms?

If it is, then the cat they tested in the chart at the bottom of the document would have run about .7 gram of rh in a cat with 2 kilograms of substrate.
And about 4.5 grams of pt.

Am I reading this right?
Randy
 
mg^-1 means miligrams per gram of something. I don't know what because I've not yet read the paper. Anything to the minus one means one over that, right popular engineering notion.



Rob,
I'm not advocating the use of resins (which can work), or leaching the values. Two of the three methods I've suggested are what industry does: smelting with a collector like copper, steel, or lead, and dissolving the substrate away leaving your PGM powder as a silt on the bottom. That's then refined and the spent waste acids are dumped. If there is any resin used, it's for stripping minute quantities of palladium out of the spent acid.
I've done that process before and I'm not afraid to do it again with pictures if need be. I'm currently working on doing the halogen extraction of values out of PGM bearing materials--working on the principle that I'm ''gas phase leaching'' the values out. I do have pictures of that.


As for what you put down the drain, what I was talking about doesn't need anything special. It should contain iron, magnesium, and aluminum--commonly found in water everywhere and components of ''hard'' or mineralized water. I have personally worked on disinfecting waste waters and am familiar enough with what can and can't go down the drain.


Lou
 
yep that is the hard part with alot of suits. you can take them to court and figure you are getting your money but may never see it. Granted alot of effort you may be able to get his wages or income tax garished but still. and you can't go after the tow shop he works at because it's not his but his uncle's.
 
Lou, i'm sure the halogen solution thing your working on is first rate. leading egde technology and will be implemented by many if and when you decide, thx.... Plattdigger, you 100% correct, we are right on the edge with this, we know what we are trying to do, just need the tool to do the job, I have sent out another email to Mr.Dow, if that doesnt work loco is only a few hrs drive from him, we'll get it soon.... That link I sent out should give a few guys on here an idea, but the iodine complex would be nice to work with with a ph of 4-5,, may take a little longer but safe and cheap. Also I liked the part that your carbons get pushed out of the wayand the resins grab hold of the pgm's before they attach,nice, i will contact the U.S mining guys today also.
 
Jbauto, he commited fraud, send the damn thing to the D.A's office and let them stare at it all day,,,,, pester the D.A to drag his ass in court and have the D.A make him produce saleable pgm's products with it, he cant , the system sucks, he will also have no satisfied customers that he can use as a defence to this charge. Provide evidence that he ripped off the idea from action mining and get Mike to give you a report of why his works and why dillers doesnt, (a sworn affidavitt) may cost you a little but it would be well worth it, if all else fails take him to judge Judy or the like, 5K, and I think you get paid right there. This would be a great T.V case!!! they are always looking for something that isnt a apartment/rent /car issue.. You may be a superstar!! Haa... :lol: Also diller will get his BIG T.V appearance that he is always talking about! ha, what a shmuck..
 
I was at the local feed and seed store yesterday and got to talking with one of the owners about the difficulty of getting chemicals. He said that fertilizer is almost unavailable and the 7% Iodine solution that he had been selling this time of year for lambing disinfectant will no longer be available because the meth labs use it in their cooking. So if you're interested in using Iodine for PM leaching, you better get it while you can.
 
Here's the ABC's for you Rob.. .. http://www.nma.org/technology/gold_production.asp ------------------------- Irons, i guess we will have to buy meth to do our leaching!
 
Its one thing froggy if you yourself knew what the hell you were doing and then attacked me for me views. You call me to get info on something you know absolutely nothing zero about. I give you the info because I AM knowledgeable in the process, matter of fact I can say I AM an expert. You will see for yourself soon when you try to do this method. Im not saying dont its good to learn something you dont know. Anyway Ill show you guys the method soon. Stay tuned.

Rob
 
1. I never said I knew what I was doing, On the contrary I posted I didnt.. I'm just trying to copy tried and true methods 2. I never attacked you for your views, just your bold statements that we are wasting our time and that you know this and want to be our savior without one bit of evidence or links to any evidence to back up your thoughts on this. I on the other hand have been Reading ,reading,talking to real experts& posting links and research from experts in the field and the lab that pose quit a contrast to your opposing views. Loco(Rich) asked you a few quiestions concerning the furnace that you have mentioned, I have asked you a few question concerning resins, you have failed to respond to either and you have failed to support your theory with anything other than hot air and an attitude of "We'll see" or "I'll show you" none of which play a particular role in finding a valid solution for any members here trying to find a viable solution to make a profit on catalyst substrate. BTW. my carbon plates will be here today and I should be up and running tommorow, and you? Frog
 
It's tried and true that lead works, same for copper. Both (more often copper) are used industrially. Thing is, I don't agree with Rob's saying it's cheaper to use the lead. They (the EPA, your municipality, hell even your neighbors if you're not zoned right) can nail your ass to the wall if you're using 2000*F and VOLATILE (meaning it's got a vapor pressure!!) lead to collect values. There are stringent guidelines for dealing with lead. You'll need to have a fume scrubber (many thousands of dollars), periodic inspections, etc. It gets worse if you employ other people!



As a general note of caution to you all considering iodine, make sure you CYA very well with a business license and proper documentation and can explain all of your glassware because it's now illegal to own elemental iodine in ANY quantity. New DEA regulations, which really are pretty stupid since anyone who really wanted iodine need only get potassium or sodium iodide, but thankfully 99% of those damned methcooks aren't smart enough (if they were, they wouldn't be ruining people's lives/hobbies/ causing extra bureaucratic red tape, etc. instead they'd have real jobs!)

Lou
 

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